Moderator: von Schweinewitz
new thing and always look at details,again if my eyes are not lying me completely
etc etc. But in some "more modern" times and more sourced, Emeric was in fact first ruler (not only Magyar i.e. Hun) that used that title at all, of all nations/tribes ;... so generally maybe indirectly he gave idea that "Serbia" should/must be kingdom, so not only negative in all, as it happened after his death etc. So fairly said and if we want to extend it again to some more ancient times - then he gave the title some prestige, based on more ancient things etc.... to sayagain, while things are pretty straightforward and clear as explainedand generally once SU I (Dandolo son) strengthened own rule (and "bastard" Dragutin de-throned him, while Miluten "restored" in some indirect way etc) i want to note, and always speek honestly, that Serbo-Hungarian coop wasn't some bad thing, that while I think that we are much older in both region and maybe history - Hungary (then) is not some totally negative image to me and honestly much better than Turkish, Byzant in times, and Bulgar overlordships etc etc. Yes, again being honest, i do think that often Hungarian (even hard as noted to use that name as we called them Magayars longer in private) historians or chronicles wrote some things trying to "give anti-Serb" tone to some our figures, often "anti-Italian" etc. but generally that Emeric title and many positives, Sigi who was not Hun at all etc. must be noted for fairness so i did etc... so i note, while clear that Venetians are that for us, someone else for someone other etc.... so, fast forward to modern times, it is almost understandable why Serbs and Italians sometimes sported some "coop" and mutual respect in modern times etc etc. Nothing is totally unrelated.... If was during 10 years of Dechanski, still youngish, so you get it, maybe explain which doesn't go as clear by my previous post... but again that is theat sense expressed on many examples - funnieat Michael 8 of Byzant writing autobiography as vampire post death - that indeed we in Europe got some years wrong and added, but hard to say, only sometimes some funny year emerge. so if it was 1319 it could be sent from exile in Constant as some "propecy" by "Dechanski" and not Miluten etc.... and he doesn't look very blind there but most likely Dushan (maybe) donated it, but minor thing.... like dear "Sharra" another cononization candidate, saying just for our future spaceships - but that "cooperation", some own "philosophy" i have since 90s, but it was different time because if we are some figuartive "banana" today, what we were then than maybe just some uneatable thing around on it, even squashed and darkened on the floor and in wars, 4-5 ...so who says that meds were worse era, at least there was some respect and deeds that pushed us above our weight if all things i spoke about are understood.... even today it is not so great, not only for us and our "sui iuris" problems, but honestly hard to say anything as whole "western world" is a bit on decline, biological problems, workforce, various "feudal like tendencies" ; etc etc. all known things so i'mnot very smart nor unique to say that etc. (not to say that we are unique even by factthat more pople leave country every year compared to other in "western world") Even then, once mighty Byzant was "weaker partner" during Miluten onwards etc etc. those are some states, with few other on continent, i'd look for best possible relations with, to say, nothing to do with own passionand themes i like, since i mentioned "philosophy" in previous post ....what is some "summarum", somehow med rulers were smarter - Dushan (for example of peak ruler not else) wasn't so frustrated after failure of that marriage with Germans, nor looked for French wife etc. he continued to write letters to Venice, gained support there, even citizenship which Ïtalian page says "was rare and hard to deserve honor for outsider",for unimportant example... so i generally lack more deeper and better ties with at least some/few countries "of our league" and some size, Greece relations are OK but even that is not place of frequent coop etc etc... indeed maybe all that social and economic questions i don't even understand makes us all uninterested for such ties and neccesserily looking towards bigger etc. So again hats off to our rulers in meds, Nemanides, when you consider all that salt on each other, almost incredible how we gained some sugar from some adressess ...people often think, "used weakness of Byzant" but actually when you look at it we were in those 150 and more years in constant troubles with actually more powerful country than Byzant, but managed... but indeed different times i just symbolically hope we, Greece and Vinegia (with Roman permit) with Hungarian AI and robots launch something in space but OK it won't be called "Enrico" for sure, maybe "Sciarra" alright far all ...BTW, generally think that last 100 years "eaten" all nice moments and thousands of years, even here on city level some do not speak about Dandola but some obscure and really why so important figurines from ww2 and similar, emperor Titus grave etc... (and our mayor is, they say, person with family house in Trieste near Vinegia, should be main figure to think about such themes)) ....i don't know why i posted this all, in moment of bore, but generally (while thanks for some help from France) what is my primar interest is medieval history esp. XII-mid XV c. and practically every small detail you maybe know if can help me or correct or simply add to any subjectm maybe something new youread or catched, as said million times... and again if I said something unprovable, wrong or unbased for any of country (mainly Italy and France i talked) my apology again but really believe in many things said 
Think my view on Colonnas, Philip IV ideas, Dandolos and how we all connected is, certainly not unique, but fresh... so generally, small repeat again, people often look at "Frnaco-Vinegian" crusade in light of mainly Byzant events, but often forget that one important side effect was what i talked about - they also sent some signal to Hungary and strengthened both our state and culture ;; ...so much funnier and more interesting but example is not most important nor something exclusive etc, just mentioning......... (glad that even small thing like new photo on wiki-page is consequence of my interest and talks))..... not important today as seen above, but think we in Europe on med subjects are far, far from finished and clear, lots to discuss and even add, correct or research ; so legit question is "who the hell is now Fante"? important for political history again) that his personal page has it all "covered", but is very interesting for us and eventual Miluten's origin......... so again, probably most "revolutionary" but i think sadly unprovable so how to say it ever in serious work, is that theory of "direct Capet" (of course then considered "just" female line) and many things so beautifully fit. Again i don't see why would someone who is from "Baldwins line" or some Hungarian settled family or even from Charles many relatives (Louis IX brother again) be (talking Miluten again) so involved and, even without papers to back all, in almost every move of not only Venice, but also French (quasi guelph) forces and also Cangrande as said... why would be same man "call Clement into help" during clash with brother etc. and why would Venice repeatedly make laws against him, which is rare example.... so any theory is not based just on similarites with Louis behavior, but also why so chirurgical moves that could be followed etc.
(so twice in history France enlarged us) but hey, for medievalists is interesting subject who Miluten was really and why brother (at first) gave him throne without violence, why suddenly something like civil war rages in Hungary and Capets are strengthened there, frustrating our rulers to extent that Miluten's line think "they should have primate" (or they should be primates, what's wording?).... btw, i also understand some Italian sensibilites of the times and is hard to judge Giacomo "Sara Columna" as he turned to "bloody France" in moments ...but unimportant and is old joke if you don't know all traditional sensibilites of Europe.... and, unlike us, France is now republic (even islamic haha, pardon) unrelated to any monarchies of the past and they would rather ruin all that cities that tie them with the past If possible, modern engineering makes wonders, ship at least Carcassonne here, look at us, having nothing of kind Petrarca was smarter, he used falsificated money in Avignon and Venice when it was alright to do so ) .....must say again since mentioned, probably one of easiest things to totally miss is that Avignon was "move made by us" (among others) initially, only visible after properly understanding Colonna motives and that Philip was tutored by one etc. Really is funny how i fell into trap of "our animosity" (quasi Albanian moves of both Miluten and HIM etc) but surely i now matured on subject and this is my final (and finally closest to truth) thread on it all, so Iwant people to think about it in proper way and not (even if unimportant today) live on lies, but now officially finished... the end, my Latin (heretical) roses ...bravo Eco, doctor indeed for (without saying clearly) knowing about our role seriously when talking about Italian events, it is even stronger maybe.... so think, while sadly original authors from long gone times (except Kesar if he is Italian at all, maybe our guy) rarely had stories and jokes about Italian figures, my addition and Dante trying to use false money goes along good for one episode ...same is with our figures, always some comical sense - but except that do take my words seriously, scientifically and truthfully if you never heard any of that ties, known only for hardcore medievalists like Eco, mad poets like Gabriele and obscure Roman families in dark kelias, like Columnas ) maybe such humor and "north Italian" satire is not even known to newer generations there but again no lies nor jokes from me on subjects it is history as it happened and believe me it was us involved in all that, my serenissima, and not laughing at all for French trying to touch you )... the end, but just to mention what is source of some satirical stance, their comics maybe...... but even without it, meds lines and "serious historians" are sometimes so funnywithout trying to be - so how to keep serious face when you find "years after death Michael wrote autobiography" in serious books.... Miluten did not kill him btw, died in prison ; also not me to be one adding to "horrible person who blinded own son and slept with kids" both lies i'd say on intelligent person for times, want my Italian serenissime to know, above all else but practically yes, in some sense step back... ....but anyway, was on something else, while even here as man, honestly liking female beauty, hinestly say that I don't have some clear opinion what is "more favorable" for average (even poor in global scale) man like me. Considering "biological crisis" I am one not blaming women at all nor chagnes in lifestyle, as indeed many males decide to not live family life, do not have kids, plus (big change from previous times) poorer people properly decided not to have kids or big families like was case before, finally started to think about "not being able to give proper life to kids" etc etc. that also quasi legendary line dates back to ancient Sparta, some king really don't know talking from head or maybe omni-present and legendary (like Servius) "Lycurg" -os replied that Sparta and its status "is best preserved by Spartans being poor and not desiring to have more their fellow citizens" ; - that mainly poor (while true compared to previous eras what was my point) decide to live childless or with less kids ; ....generally no rule, even those having stable jobs, enough material abilities decide to be so, hidding behind "not good" ; ....so no rule there so i BTW remebered from head those lines attributed to actually kings of old times not "proleteriat" or similar ....but honestly, both Rome and Sparta were sh*t, and too liberal sexually and created just a lot of problems to this beautiful, spece destined humanity..... ...btw, nothing to say to meds leaders, they took a lot of money they did not deserve but "krk!" heads fell ...but even that is honestly myth, "command from first lines" and so on, some yes some no, George was mostly counting behind ), some sultans and Euro kings fatly behind first line nor we all were exactly defended by "our guys" always as mercs were widely used and so on, so on some fileds (not that)) there was some "French Templar bastard" against "our good hero French" sometimes...... it was one Dandolo who i think changed usual mercs for "military draft", iirc is btw ex-waterpolo player, even one who was once maybe baest in the world in his sport.... resepect for that, fair to say... funny part is that he is involved in ww2 figurines, he was also involved in recent "controversy" regarding new central bus station here (for national and international maybe lines, not city bus) and how initially name was writen in latin letters, so he urged it to be changed in kirilineko and only english and funny things like that ) ....despite obvious opinion of what we have to do with it and that region, I remind all that exactly Serbian is one of (facultative i.e. by choice) recognized official languages in ex-Zululands i.e. South Africa... talked subject since Brit empire we had some emigration and presence there so language gained even status... can't say we were included in wars against Zulus or Dutch/Boers but who knows ...all said for fun and as purely pub themes ; as for latinic letters, uh-oh - the Turks known for stealing both lands from Greeks (not to say Romeans) and ones once using Arabic culture and heritage for centuries, did not make any drama about Latin letters use sapienti sat. that said i absolutely support and love whole Italy, as law and as said.... be greeted and as said, if any interest to exchange any opinion or new fact on many mentioned things, welcome to me - things of no importance but personal pleasure ; Petrarca and citizenship to our king etc etc. but who in the world knows that... but small known intermezzo from this medievalist.... wish was there at least in one battle with this playing for me and some unavoidable wine.... ....in political sense though we of course did not abandon idea of regianing "Serbica" (Sofia) and renaming it back, so we are not in particular hurry to move Miluten yet seriosly, important to mention as fun fact for example to younger Croats if interested, sometimes feel that even (for example) Brits know of have idea about that more than some speaking same language, so history is fun.... ...repeat, this is both "diplomatically composed", truthful to extent (but why would we trust Constantine as his words being "facts" completely as he liked Stefan etc) and too me maybe most important of all - very enigmatic and in detective way (not exactly Agatha but close)) writen article so on scale from 1 to 10 some 7 ) ....why enigmatic and nice, as it indirectly trying to say few important things... that that area between modern Serbia nad Bulgaria was "disputed and fluid" that old Serbs indeed used bloody Latin words like true cornered Roman legions and that some our scholars had effect of spreading it wider "like Latin literarute in the west, we did it in other areas" etc. Not purely Serb thing, not purely Bulgar but indeed Serb name and toponyms more fit in some old Roman words etc etc. without any needless controversy here, so Eng gave it "all clear" touched Este possesions and attacked Stefan's forts, just BTW said to mention why story in his "sources" is incomplete as we are talking of much more continentaly involved person than Bulgarian rulers ever were in last 500 years then, so he couldn't comprehend completely all Serb factions and ties ...but without few mistakes, generally good one for other things mentioned and giving reader clear suspension and enigma, but touching clearly that ancient things and "Serb theories" but who knows, in this way only good for some drama flik to conquer "Anglo Sexon" markets with good taste for it ) ...hope yu make any conclusions but again, short but very good article, touching many things but also that i talked just on surface as things we talked about are from 1000 years before and dragged along.... - never used pure fiction and probably heard story that (very drunk)) Vukashin survived battle and threw few lines on it, for example that's fact. ...just demonstration that there was no fiction in story and that man and court where Konst. died, was in some "old debt" to George "golden fork".... mentioning Connery and his other roles, generally "golden fork" sounds like good villain from 007 series and did I tell that 007 was our guy blah blah ...sold to Sexons, but generally and excuse my small wits, was serious how you look at details and connect them on any on first sight unvisible story without much fiction at all. think enough from me while active, as always something i honestly think valuable and for knowlwdge expanding he was recepient of "prestigeous award" in Italian eyes, rarely awarded citizenship to non-Italian ; and one guy who surely shaken some roots of both western and eastern monasticism and religion by daring actions and attack on churches, for example... conquest unimportant and wouldn't surely last forever ; ....emissary of powerful papacy came to him talked to him and couldn't publicly say anything against him, so extraordinary figure for small tribe - and last by not least, and why archeological part was important,confirmed that he was among tallest European rulers of times and history, so figure frm fairytales indeed generally subject of his and Miluten's knowledge and ties is interesting, why not continentally while subject of some origins super interesting.... gnerally on wide range of subjects must say that on English language pages found some truthful and honest things, and generally even respect... really Bulgarian capital (while super story of old name)) and any part of Greece, Macedon or what to us unimportantand if important it is one of countries we have one of better relations generally ; so take it as science what it is... probably that much for now, while i have until mid week etc. In fact (as rankings mentioned history as well) for its size and population most objectively and when you really know details and not engaged in "pamphletism" Serbia is country of unproportionally (for again size) "big" historical footprint and influence, things it took part in and spread around no argument and our med ties just approve ;...but anyway, even without it, subjects are fun... it is ot our fault that once tich and visited libraries were ruined, many paintings as well etc etc. and (for example) rich library of our monastery 100m from "holy sepulture" in Jerusalem finished in Vienna, Moscow or Kiev... or Kiwi (nothing bad in word and it is our word, Latin as well, while using other is free choice if you want to make "message") maybe not in line with city of the time (which was also relatively small) but point is that never realized and both we and French decided to first "punch Austrians i.e. Habsburgs" and revenge both unsuccessful marriage bid for our king for Habsburg girl (who was also greatgrandchild of maybe "Capet" king so French had interest for revenge)) and not only that but also centuries of rivalry between French lines and Hansburgs, even without us so French were were weaker side..... both our "important" kings were in Paris, knew Paris, so both Milan (while sleeping with Churchil's mother is success, he could realistically learn more there)) and of course so called "Pierre", Peter who arguably even took part in defense of Paris in 1870s etc... I think that inability to recognize some nice moment is reflected as deep and as wide that I'm 110% sure that even on small jobs better candidates for place are often rejected and worse taken and things like that ; ...really that much, our things to us, but if you have some meds stories, even ancient we maybe do not know or from dif angle, very welcome and some objective, not subjective talk in any way ithink with "we had St Louis daughter" wins for now (as theory, supported as fiction by few French historians) and so on.... but ones that our higher class was in Greece, descendent from Felix legion or similar not bad... other things youmaybe heard for first time are not theories, just known before for experts, so Andrea-Petrarca-Dushan trio, Colonnas and Contis with us, Miluten arresting Michael Paleolog maybe at Kavala etc etc. etc etc. And always mind i'm not expert nor huge private lover of modern history, just knowledge geos by itself... Sigismund gave cities (except George who had to return as being Venetian spy)) to really being on same side "in Colonna camp" often (and spiritual franciscans) etc etc. Sexons (not those ones we usually mean)) in mines and communities that often did hard job for Georges profit etc. Hey, Germans were ready to crush half of Czechland and Poland maybe - but not us at all, Teutons even served as robots ; ...historical truth. Later, mentioned Orthelius was German in some origin (not distant), Habsburgs really favored us, enabled "krajinas" more or less, but even in Trieste example, while Italians worked on our "palaces and institutions" it was meeting with Mother Theresa who ordered that "Serbs must be listened, or..." and further, already had enough of typing ) but clear and fair i'd say... interesting is why then i personally (while Claudia is/was super) I'd still prefer Flavia Felix and think that joke to rename Vienna back to "Barbara Silva" is super and even Germans laugh on it etc. Both legions were related and possibly (or surely depends on historian i guess) raised by Kaius.... what do you men which Kaius, well Kaius Kesar! as we say, conqueror of Kalia and put them all in kelias ;.... while i did make reference to her ) and if you ask we were close to "royalize" two like her in meds, from I'd say maybe top German families of the times, also could be added to "renown of small tribe".... i really can't explain that moment BTW, theorized a lot, all up to Servian well and for collective "barbarians" (so Franks, all Germans, Normans who also contacted us etc) known legions and fighters stationed in lands we controlled, but maybe it was that "arrest of Boris sons" (maybe even him but hidden) that launched "Serbs" into some fame, speculation.... in a way like relatively small "Hungarians" were maybe famed for "Hun" name, we were maybe related to prominent legions in area maybe etc. so i think more than obvious manipulation and why important to look at other moments before saying anything or think twice.... but we i think discussed it enough, think my standpoint is valid on few ocassions and it is important if we are to understand events, not just have some chaotic stories around.... simply, we are not only talking absence, but also what i'm saying is that there was no hurdle for Sigi to simply even attack some possessions, let alone even enlarge Stefan's... if we even accept that they respected us "more" or even knew some secrets - Louis just few crowns before Sigismund had no problem to at least attack (or probe as he always retreated or just took at least what Sigi gave) much more powerful Dushan the HIM pure logic at work, no mythomania... think worth repeating in moment of mention, as well as gladly accepting any independednt thinking why (could be said) Germans and Franks etc. had some respect 500 years before while "kissed Serb (ekavian)) bitt a bit" and supported us, while 500 years fast forward it was the opposite ....funny but true. Second obvious joke is on same line "are you sure that Sigi wasn't Serb in origin?" ...and third joke is - when you consider that once when "Germany had border with Croatia and Bosnia, they attacked them" well you can't blame the Serbs, it is natural etc. but views of Stefan total absence and maybe "turning around" at Ankara are legit... actually if things like those are true i even respect them much more.... and honestly do not even like to talk XV c, nor Turks honestly, nor Bosnia nor Croats ) that much, but Stefan and George deserve special magnifying glass just for reasons mentioned, as some think that we "disappeared" from map earlier, while there was huge and eventful 50-70 years more.... "Golden fork" is huge subject for film .........btw, also seen that Wiki page on Sigi states (quasi) how he is recently "renewly interesting for modern talks on themes in central Europe" etc etc. don't consider much myself "central Europists" as we are more "land of Rome" and somehow more similar - but glad i could add something fresh on subjects - so definitevely good old Sigi chopped few heads but in the same time good character for us, gave capital, gave respect and asked in situations surely better than also old pals Habsburgs in 1914 (but if Elisabeth "Claudia" Hanbsy survived and became our queen before Hungarian, who knows, who knows.......)) ...always add if know, really tried my all in some "give something new on old themes" approach, so hopefully enriched every reader.... in some way it is point in us researchers of older themes, to surprise and give hidden details.... but also (Huns maybe know, schoolars certainly) there are things like Eugene and his ilk trying to lead some "new defense" including that one bishop who was in defense of then Hungarian held Belgrade was Eugene's man of confidence (and hence anti-Colonna) and things like that, maybe too deep for forums like these.... so might be that George and his behavior, Venetian agent aside ), might be or should be looked through that prism as well, if we accept that we almost never went far differently than "Colonna stand" and opposed or ignored Roman factions almost as they did.... even regardless of Conti stand, so important to mention that one our faction actually on events around Emeric, Dandolo rise and our kingdom declaration, directly opposed Conti pope ("Not-guilty 3")) if known. While i postulate that many times Contis found some mutual line against (maybe non-Roman i.e. Venetian Orsini), there were insatnces of opposite - anyway, George times could be one moment when Colonnas aagain dominated "our discourse" (like Miluten, like Dushan)... maybe i doubt, but really hope you understand alland how we can look at George as well.... so more pro-papal Albans even in moment supported some action, some Hungarians but George had "double minds" because Colonnas just again got into trouble with "Rome" in about years of our fall.... etc. and greeting Barbarossa ) etc... so generally i see in it another tie and possible speculation of our nobility image among Greeks and Italians, but needless to repeat 1000 times, absolved almost. among Roman nobility, secular but also clergy to extent... interesting terminology and yes it is in a way connected with what you think but not as explicit way, so word is going about some mistersses (kurvokratia)). However, same family which dominated much of Roman life in some times before we gained prominence also is related to some reforms, possibly idea of clerical celibacy and similar so changed image of earlier times in more moral way... also they launched reforms in strengthening role of popes/clerics maybe some more "papokesarism" idea, and also something that Innocent III sported - papal laws etc. etc. went to far from joke and it is becoming boring but remember term "pornokratia" ) ...AND again those are not Colonnas at all, who were both more secular and pro-imperial or similar, even connected to idea of some ancient philosophy or art forms... but not naked things ) so merely wanted to tell as interesting story, while it is not same family again if you get this one as well ; even more due to imperial cities, forts etc. clear thing. You get my meaning behind this.... also people are often not able to distinguish "true modern eyes" that nobility and people were different things and that was no source of "mass communication" or info, so any press, media, TV, radio or internet only rulers get some messengers and similar... so more than expected clashes already starting in Hungary, Peter the Kermit had to fight for Singidunum and Tuarunum (so Belgrade area) maybe siege and fight true like in old times when Felix operated Godfrey was maybe surrounded in one moment by some "Serbs" (but he killed them) and similar shocks and generally comical stories.... equally true is that some Serb ruler named Bodin (sounds equally Slavic like Baldovin and Branus we had)) greeted them, "confirmed all ties" (so our rulers knew about it) even words "brotherly" was used by some crusader chroniclers etc. Must understand the locals it was like "WTF? barbarians all around out of nowhere" and impression that they are here for them.... ......really thought much about Claudia recently, reminding myself even.... one of first in "cisalpine Kaul", around Lutetia (Paris), around Alesia, around Belkia, one of only in Britain etc. - but Claudiareally found happines and long settled here, near me where she stayed for years........ bravo, smart one (loved her) Probably most notable story and a lot, really many events there, beside story of Boris clash in our history before rise of Nemanides, so who likes hope likes ) i.e. smart to extent as he stood idle few times when escpected to act allowing Norman victory twice etc. Really nice stories and tells a lot about some our previous history and path to strong state that later occured... (also mentiones properly his meeting with Raymond "Monocolus" of Touluse, story is preserved in French chronicles) Our "enigmatic" parts continued by it... but also shows how truly strong Nemanide state was, and situation turned, we arresting Byzantine emperors and marching with armies often in totally different way through areas... skillfully played indeed. Again, hope you like as it is on of best stories of our pre-Nemanjich times, shows that something bigger was in the making, and if you like hope you want more always join, really would like to hear what you like from era oh, Norman wives such bombs After death of king Bodin she involved herself in politics and Serb "civil war" on behalf of her underage sons and pretendents etc. using methods like "slow-working poison" on other Serb prince (which did not work and he survived), urged military captains to behead some others "in front of Ragusa walls", and using agents to allegedly "castrate and blind" third player in stories, so lovely... but of course not all were like that, at least we and Englisg had many ; but those stories about powerful Norman princesses almost in line... but she was still our queen )... luckily Anna and Helen were nothing like that.... but Jaquinta fire. so yes, while i and most always concentrate mostly on Nemanide Serbia, some great stories before (and after as mentioned)... so i did not post Matilda (nor Philip) clip for no reason and Serbo-Norman coop was seemingly deep and productive & we should not ignore that period if lovers of older themes ....on that to say, while his fathers name (which was later name of one our youngest prince which did not mature due to Jaki finishing in jail) indeed sounds more "Lombard" it is often stated that they were "Normans", but isay million times that names per se are "wrong way" in some ethnicity distinction way and not should be proof of anything.... so southern Italy was place of great mixing and various tribes, like here, but important to note that even some clear Norman persons had even "latinized or greekezied" names even, long before our queen (was Norman Sergius etc).... so we all take it they were of Norman or half origin in our case, supported with our stand and great allieance with Normans in here times etc. in any way our beauty did not leave room nor time for any choice, smart girl ....lovely story, what else to say and even glad that we had her, almost similar like English i said - but compare how far Brits went on self promotion around the world and presenting stories cinematically and how far we.... eeee, Barbara. ...really and honestly speaking, very stretched out to even include that, personally while no "anti-Alba" bias inthatsense, just scientifically speaking.... clear lingvistical line of Illirian and modern Albanian is not 100% found, but i have no trouble in some "be nice" sense to even accept that Albans and Illirians might be related, in a way like giving "Marcus Aurelius death place" to Austrians if they want any "importance", just being nice and friendly..... lastly, simplified and shortly, as talked it is obvious that Serbo-Croat (esp. Serb ekavian again) have more same forms and words from Latin even pronouncements, directly same as Greeko-Latin.... Much more than Albanian, which i little know, but this is science... "Prokedim" you all etc. But OK, if some notion is that Serbs are more similar to Celtic and Latin caste (so conquerors) hence liguistical forms, while Albanians with some Iliirians (Dicletianus is their no trouble), it is alright interpretation to me.... nothing political there, just some notions that Alnbanians want to "gain some fame" on few pages... just do not take her as "feministic figure" and model, rather Dusciano as one ....btw, btw, little important but one of theories "regarding Normans and us" that Serbs might be some very old, "umbrella tribe" and root of word like "Suebi, Suedi etc etc" so kinds "they knew eachother fo long" some warrior elite etc. Nice like all but little important for concrete histories, which i like and is "cool" how of all tribes first strong alliance in the west (except Italians) was our and Norman.... btw, last joke on subject - unlike some other memebers of our (tribe above all although Dioclea i.e. Zeta was part of Serbia through whole Nemanide period from which they descend) royal family which she ordered beheaded or poisoned, she "castrated etc" her brother in law i.e. should be brother of her late husband well, well... great story again, already have nice scenes in head... you get it Can't say anything for sure but of course some obvious things are there, so if lover conclude yourself, other things interesting but almost none for our story..... btw, again for lovers, our kings and esp. emperor Dushan was connected with Bari in few ways, and some story is that he preffered also Normans for personal guard (allegedly often looking for very tall knights due to his size) and allegedly imperial standard bearer (of over 20-30 kgs) leading his coloumn was "Swedish", not really important for what i'm looking for but remembered story etc. ...interesting is also to extent did it carry some fame to France enabling later desire of Capet or something like official France to tie with us etc. ...could be said that western sources were often "secretive" on direct ties with us, so inability to determine Helen's origin etc ;...maybe intentionally but maybe others lied too much.... on Jaquinta, you might wonder why I ask - preparing great film hitting cinemas near you in summer of 2065 let it be another subject i.e. their origin if eventual Italian researcher or lover, so i have few questions as always ) but gave it up long time ago, but nonetheless since already talked much why not sharing for lovers of themes, maybe you like to read but company always welc great stories, hopefully liked my little detective game and any conclusions was alliance real or imagined by Byzantines and of course Jaquinta story if we guess that many of you hear it first time - i'm Serb some details are nasty but above all i see also strong female character, kinda "warrior queen" as Matilda/Maud that defended some right she to be recognized as ruler after death of king, which was indeed above rules and traditions, plus foreign... Anna D. and Helen are characters of similar type as both succeeded in intent to secure crown for sons, SU I and SU II Miluten, so it was indeed kinda some our trademark of times etc.... don't know who is current president of Normandy region (if we had proven anything about her origin but i tried few stories)) but i'll gladly call him with short question "250 meters?" ....and it also showed that indeed huge male like HIM could have been more gentle to own relatives that one small pale Norman princess, a female ...but like her, as Serb say Jaquinta was cute ) and some figure with vision ) ...in interesting medieval details he and his line, already governing Rascia before Bodin's death and having largely separated from Dioclea was untouched so they are not involved in any mentioned story of "beheading, poisoning and castration etc", which was fate of other brothers and nephews of Bodin and that Petrislav... already during Bodin life Rascia continued the most energetic fight against Byzantium, Alexios intervened personally in few battles and submitted Rascian rulers. However, most likely that "Vladimir", son of other brother, was some player of Rascia, the one whome Jaquinta used "slow-working poison" on, unable to directly face him etc. etc. since Nemania (use of letter "j" was uncharacteristic for old Serbian) also line of very tall rulers start, culminating with for times indeed huge emperor HIM ;....and so on, hope i gave some understandable picture of their origin with some small mystery and how Rascia became powerful, at short moment even most powerful in SE and from which line they descend... open to questions might have had changed history more than she knows by eliminating some pretenders in interest of Rascian line ... first funny thing.... but even that aside, explain to me sounds really funny when stop for moment on unimportant line, as many times when some "linguistical propositions" are mentioned... kinda like it is from Hungarian "ur", sounds like name Vukan is from Chinese-Turkic-etc. "wu" meaning something and so on.... animalistic symbols and love much more spread even as late, even after schism even in Italy so indeed might be actually true that it is the way we read Latin Ursus, adding to fact that name was "revitalized" for kings by Dandola and later HIM for his son, but present in lower ranks wider and mostly in Serbia adding to more Italian tie than Hungarian as Croatia was directly ruled by Hungary, Bosnia etc. But it remains more or distinctively Serbian name, as was then etc. Besides, Urosh I (now talking Anna's son) and Dushan the HIM were surely more "Italian players" and lovers than directly Hungarian esp. second if you get it .....unimportant subject for much time waste, but why not using some checks again, even logic... to me, more likely from some "Urso" reading and Italian name as solution etc. ...jokes aside, gravely serious about previous paras, but generally unimportant.... one way or another, could be said that we directly opposed any "Ursini faction" as said before.... for some science and timeline, while Hungary gained some prominence later, centuries of before ties with Byzant and Italian lands should not be disregarded, Venetians that were used to "do things for us" (like freeing Bodin) and all.... but generally we all concluded that such lines regarding lingvistics are always or very often dubious, still laughing at "Serbs use Greek words bre and more from Ottoman" while in the same time more is known about some more obscure princes of no lasting importance... targeted? to mention, after looking at Wiki Eng, it seems that also thirs name for him was in circulation - so Zavida, "White Urosh" and also Stefan in some Dalmatian sources. Interesting to say the least, but that much, hope you gained another lovely story again from Norman queen, Robert Guiscard to creation of Nemanide state and dynasty ...always add, needless to repeat - yes you! .....generally it seems that some "loyalties" kept themselves for centuries back in times, so my Colonna long lasting example, could be said that also maybe our ties with Normans were "centurial" adding even more to interesting time when "official i.e. Capet" or Frankish France ) took over some possesions both in France but also areas like Sicily as known ; and so on... in that sense i think previous stories are of value for even lovers... guess it is surprise for many that actually Rascian line (with more orthodoxy in state) was the most energetic against Byzant as early, and more "Norman friendly" than some others, giving protection and army to Jaquinta's son trying to reinstall him etc.... speculation is and hence unimportant theory of many that Nemanja's father was indeed from somoene else, maybe even George of Jaki among others if we are to speculate.... he got in conflict with other brothers or half ones and they gave him small land initially, George and Jaquinta once controlled, but things turned and he become starter of most famous line etc etc. but it was republic of course so no need, if even anything about our player and heroine Jaki is 100% true ) ...all lovely, hope you like how i put it, scientifically as always for her and afterwards pointing my bloody lance with flower on top towards her, and similar....) seriously, what i like in era is exactly that to extent, that we almost faced veterans of Hastings (and maybe Stamford bridge)) just few years after, but no need to sweat as Normies did it for us, we just watched the show ....there is charm and we medieavalists know very well why loving themes, even if battle is not mentioned at all ....no sarcasm, lovely and true - we knew. Great times when fate of kingdom of England in a way, Serbian kingdom and even Byzantine empire was decided and some same people took part in it..... nothing against Sexons of course but since they have some sense of humor, think you also don't mind us just watching your guys suffer and no hard feelings.... of course no humor, grateful to A-S experts for explaining it as tactics thenand if realistic it is super that it happened on far apart corners of continent, and of course i'm glad we had some role in it ...more added to both correct myself (since nobody here talks about) but also to confirm my words thatwe knew indeed ; after reading article on Hastings of which we all knew already this or that..... nice stories. Another nice moment for history lovers, to add from our side so even on personal level Bodin maybe had some knowledge of Anglo-Saxon operating around before arrival of Guiscard and Jaquinta... mentioing Antioch as well, meeting between him and Raymond of Toulouse is in that sense also not BTW or dinneras could be said that Bodin had valuable info to Raymond, knowing personally city, fortifications and plans, so could be guessed that it is why meeting was valuable and "brotherly", it is not excluded, as any crusade that some unnamed our nobles joined etc etc. , Guiscard and Nemanja mystery all makes it super, think worth every word for true likers, comparing and giving further details... not to mention potential for great jokes even with English as "bridge" is mentioned and historical records of their activity and defeats (or our hoolies)) at Nish, Kosovo and shame at Durazzo ...but on serious details i think that much, hope added nice things ...really be cool and relaxed, for example Sexons and make our history cooler and more independent not on lies at all, but by some proper interpeatations admit that our Jaquinta is almost in rank of great Matilda, that we crushed your "veterans of Stamford bridge" (just imagine killing Norwegian king on game, who inthe world even want to fight Norwegians at all?)) even without moving our Italian ties and that Norman wives usually chosen us instead of you..... etc. and so on but generally was serious if someone younger reads.... and similar out of the mind things... of cours they were Serbs but generally unimportant, today Montenegro is not even geographically similar to Diclea nor Zeta and capitalof both was even city which is in today norther Albania, so how can we even equalize it with Montenegro as it is not today, as it is not Serbia.... but there is the point isn't it so it is funnyin some shyness but I think nobody here even care about that and their "Serb ethnicity" isn't even controversial..... what i like and whatall foreign historians mentioned is that moment - our Rascian line gave protection to Jaki's son, gave him army and reinstalled him, honorably to the max... some say he afterwards even invaded Rascia some do not say that, so did it happen but like the moment, think maximally correct from our Vukan and Marko and "White bears" ....get read yourself of small politizations, think there is not controversy there and we can all, both in region and wider (they are mad about my stories in England)) enjoy some great history we had and created, not just Rome but Rascia called quasi Serbia ...BTW, Byzantines many use when they want, when they do not they don't called - totally unimportant in discourse of Montenegro btw but saying in contrast to "Sklavinije or Sclavonie etc" called in contemporary work land of Mihailo, hence Bodin's papa, in Latin "Triballorum et Serborum regnorum" or like if i did not use corect declination but close (Byzantines often used Latin titles for works but wrote in Greek below, except Michael 8 Paleolog which was written by our agents in his blood mostly)) so kingdom of Tribalii and Serbii, but generally unimportant, I'm just lover of details and uninterested in any ethnic contests or politiztions, and of very soon great lover of Jaquinta only, even (my heart breaks) a bit forgetin Anna................ hope you get some serious and also comical parts out of this post too and some maybe even instructions to some western historians of future how we could make even more cooler and connective history and maybe more recognition for us in best intention way said, justwith intention to make any Norman wife think twice...... but do not trust me... really wanted to revolutionarize it a bit but without any lie, and whynot always some great subjects surelly there, so expect if myeye catches.... etc. But there is no problem there i honestly think and it is relaxed subject... real moment of Montenegro as subject is in modern history as mentioning, predating Serbia as independent etc etc. even boring theme...... btw, humoristically i had some nice slaps to Monetengro talkers in light way, as my last name is something they consider "of Montenegro origin" "from Marko" but i always say that moment and Marko the Serb prince "which disappeared" but whose son Urosh is etc. so i like that moment, but of little value to history just personal joke ....we don't have some preserved sources in churches and similar due to devastation, nor i ever researched in some deepness, but allegedly our line (from father line) is very old in area of place where dspot Stefan was born, some smaller town in inner Serbia and lived there in medieval times, with possible moves here and there, so hardly directly (in modern sense) from Montenegro.... but like jokes about it - so i joked how it stayed small due to many Vinegian forts, but could be added to repertoir this one also "it stayed small due to Jaquinta being queen" ...or actually as i mentioned, just like France who kept "Angevine" name under Capets etc..... you know also what is interesting in some way - some Montenegro researchers do not dislike our attitude as some others "as imperial or this or that", sometimes they dislike it for other resons in medieval discourse - as they felt that mainstream Rascia often gave little attention to those lands, concentrating more on some Macedon etc. so there is trick and twist in how people usually understand things and some dislike not "imperial attitude" of our med kings but almost oppositely - why the flik some our kings made concesions to Ragusa or similar - but really unimportant, fun as many... generally i think i corrected it well - so Bodin and Jaquinta are important moments for our history, full respect if you think that I gave some privilege to Anna and lions of Brankovich family ; - indeed 235 m (in talks but it is going down)) deserving ....not so much in modern themes myself, even XIX and i totally transcend and transform mentally in some other era when talking medieval subjects, not so much similar to national subjects, properly...... hence Ireallydo not think that moment when Jaquinta "castrated" your prince is that moment when state was created properly said it was XVIII-XIX c so i think we can relax about it.... personally, always say that in light tone think "Zeta" would be much cooler name today in some international way even, but they would always be placed among last by alphabet what is disliked i guess, instead of that "Vinegianism" but unimportant.... anf finally I say - Montenegro is out future! (lands of just some few 100,000 old members) always join some joke, what you think etc... ....you little.... not claiming anything like Dushan (is it from Montenegro?)) and direct line from Christ, but just from Mars, realistically so to say, with some fresh interpretations, connecting and detcting ; .....for small example (while did not read even close to all) until myself I did not read any work which connected almost every our crucial moment since Miluten with Dandolo dogo, never until myself read a work which connected Colonna's "saltings" with our events, rejected that HIM had the line, Miluten such sex and Stefan d-spot was ever there as he would be served "on plate" to Sigi maybe, etc etc etc. proposals to think about, but first mentioned is fact not "proposal" so generally yes, that family was certain ally of Nemanides through whole period.... it is hobby my real job is action one, i'm in constant, daily touch with foreigners (and even have licence to touch if need be)) so a bit tired of them and xenophobic (had them over the top)) and almost "professional deformation" to daily contact and comment foreign ladies - no joke but will never tell as this is not forum about personal things ) .... (that Louis IX had another daughter is not mine))...... generally like i cleared Sciarrillo "Sara" name and way to his sainthood is open, if pope took my e-mail seriously ...as said maybe sometimes, thanks for reading, always open to your story ....since this touches your interests more than mine, let it be another question as i knew it only as "fun fact" and one line if you ever read anything more, why or better asked based on what he claimed it, just fantasy based on nothing or they actually produced something like story or line? ...of course just BTW question for some principessa from there if ever read, not even much important to me.... (but totally over proportioned, it was mainly French action to end slavery there)) one during Miluten's takover of throne, 3rd during Dushan's takover and 4th, Andrea during our greatest expansion and empire proclamation.... but state of Vinegia was in huge troubles and really pushed on all fronts by Genova, Hungary and nature etc. unlike us only briefly invaded by Louis, repeat and short summary of mid XIV c if you missed.......however, one thing - blame Wiki as it has dif dates, there is date on other language pages which says that Sciarrillo died in Venice but year before Francesco took office, so absolutely not my fault they "printed" wrong dates on few places, for what it matters as subject as all - maybe only to extent did Dandolo family supported Colonna one in Italy etc. "Anna Dandolo" still remains great name for space battlecruiser, but "Jaquinta" deserves it as well, so we have really nice and diverse name candidates for galactic showdown ;..... to repeat, there was that unimportant and btw question if you read ever some text, had few of them, mostly found some answers, on this will not search much so amybe you heard.... or to call Alessandra, often on Ital state TV that much. - intimatelyone of my favorites as said as it touches some ancient "Macedon" name, not because i care much about modern subjects etc. I mean i posted it before, but this is my fav photo from 1912 and "First Baklava war" it is powerful in a way, although maybe not so significant historically just i like it..... IDK, foeign made, not from our army photographers, maybe some French journey - French spied on their future ally (actually present ally as they prepared us for it all since Bodin and 1070s)) or similar, but likeable... so our troops not entering Scupi or Uscub or Skop(j)le just patroling and marching through it few months after they captured it before, allegedly some fall of 1912... while troops do not look so "fancy" due to caps etc love the captured expression on officer faces, some look in the "distance", uneasy faces and pulled out sabres ) ...ghostly exterior, lack of crowds unlike some present few months before - some trouble with Bulgarians maybe in the air etc. Strong if unimportant photo, even incontrast to famous photo of emperor Dushan 600 years before and his crowning on same place, cheering crowd and generally place which then looked much richer in 1340s ......as said combined, subject is philosophical and one of favs, when you imagine "Greeks" "Macedon" and so on.... fun fact is that 600 years before we could hardly (never) find Alexander in our ranks while there were Baldovins and Altomanuses, 600 years past probably many, including incoming regent and kings before him ...great theme, liked to share this photo again, although totally not in my field and some basic interests.... give some likable moment if you wish ; 
Also, must warn you it is partly fictional - as for Serbs never wore those "tight pants" back then. But I said clearly that there were many foreigners around ....our girls did wear them though, mostly your nationals but our girls ) usually older men had it more..... and HIM is only around 35 and we have no proof that he ever had such big beard ;.... but except such small details, generally nice photo and he properly showed important detail, that contrary to Greek claims and trolling about "furs as clothing" seriously our courts looked more western than something else, be it east-Slavic, Hungarian or Byzantine style... so he properly researched and guessed that frescoes depict rulers more in Byzant style and religious motives, in contrast to how they maybe looked and dressed/armoured in everyday style and battle.... if it was other way, our dressing style would never penetrate "fashionable" Italy and further.... helmets of the his era for higher class are properly depicted (i mean closed ones, without viziers, boy is holding HIS, "Palman" his own etc - parade ones, cermeonial but also for battle although users hated them so vizirs were introduced which they often raised). Armour so-so, still reinforced chain with extra plates etc..... but now i'm boring ) nice two photos to compare... that much - Bulgars then Bulgars 600 years post - Bulgars are our destiny seriously, despite maybe your own ideas, traditionally that was one of biggest rivalries in region, they frustrated often by us etc. not some else if you think... but now we are incredible pals, nobody wants anything - we just Miluten, St. Sava they delivered "hot and fresh" and such small things from others... like Epirus.... noooooooo!! no Epirus say something you like, always listening 
(where there is indeed some Albania region, which is BTW exonym and they do not call themselves "Albanians nor Arnauts"(as was our older name) Totally mediocre world we are living at and (sadly) standards are going down by every day.... Internet was great progress to extent - fast and independent information, fast facts and ability to find something (and of course glorious pornokratia)) BUT seems will be used as predicted to hyperproduce texts of all sorts under cover of "serious" ones, not even on forums etc.... really hope this was comical at least on both sides maybe etc. ...long live (at lest 50 years more)) Servia of Serbia known as Serdia etc, too bad our figures are "turning into graves" from which they were already kicked out disrespectfully ; with too much lies and denial.... must say Ieven or almost understand people less and less deep on anything, desire to follow naked chicks, sportists and similar - as we are joke as planet etc. mainly wanted to incite somone from Italy for some help, but unimportant now - reread sometimes and get where is some base for theories and similar..... we are not contesting any "oldness" like Dr Albans, we are not claiming foreign figures, and we had more than enough own history - sadly not marked enough, our fault .....but Alba Longa is always fun subject, great trolls or modern age, and once we are gonne in the future we will surely be great pals and we having a lot of your girls as ours..... always fun, invite without any expectation to all liking older subjects as always, humor welcome as well but onserious subjects something informative or new.... (Alba and Kravata are my favs of nations, honestly so take it light) etc. but serious and scientific base for suspicion do exist in our case, Italians themselves or at least some Italians looked for mutual tie through whole era even though recognizing and naming region "Sclavinie" due to majority.... in political sense unimportant, of course but just some people to understand that "Latin tie" and our general mystery, scientifically. With "White Serbs" of some Czechlands and Germany there is not enough genetic and linguistical tie, but we did have some good ties with Germans even through era (what Lombards are as well in origin) etc etc. If something i forgot, maybe some other time but hope i summarized in serious way all this.... only some elites here and in Italy knew some facts, now maybe hidden or long lost through time... language per se is what defines and groups modern nations or tribes so it is Slavic language "Serbo Croat" but think about it, black in US (for example) use perfect "Anglo-Sexon" but are not "Anglo-Saxons" themselves etc. Like the mystery if nothing else and like (though empire was sh*t of orgy and mysery)) tie with direct Latins, Etruscans (as said also enigmatic word "Ras" nobody knows when introduced for us is similar to Etruscan one, their endonym etc)). Too much for too much time ) just summary (pardon, they say but i don't buy it) later communists etc etc. BUT to hear that there was longer reigning Pope that "raped nuns" is scandalous ....imagine newspaper title today "Pope raped nuns" and so on... luckily our Colonnas (i think they are not even related to conti of Tusculum) and Contis were nothing like that, on the other hand they were often on "receiving end" and raped etc. ; ....really Italy suffered so much for so long, no sarcasm. But, personal opinion as every human subject is alright, think that some "sexual accusations" were often used as weapon..... simply, pure example, Greeks wrote a lot about era and for example there is no word about any sexual harrasment during Dushan's and all foreigner penetration and conquest through Byzant, our biggest example... but not crucial, history is philosophical discipline. Yes, yes we are special case, big gentlemen of era kept Jaquinta, Anna and Helen untouched for all those years past their king's death despite big factions of unfriendly nobility towards them.... etc. not to mention that our emperor HIM was among first "imperial religious feminists" on continent, did I tell? total is myth that we Serbs look for any "political points" or "territory" by liking or discussing honestly some subjects, on the contrary there was too little knowledge and false narratives through centuries that we simply feel intrigued and offended, almost hurt by some representations. Plus, as said million times, so many gaps and mysteries is what interest us in some older themes, few nations have so many enigmas and unknowns.... glory to Italy in that sense really shocked many by some findings or knowledge ....even that Abraham Ortelius map is partly (except he being old pal German in some origin)) also due to his talks and visits to Italy where he supplemented previous knowledge about our tribe.... to say, but think i finish this interesting subject and theories with it, always join with some content we to grow and florish......... but as said no sarcasm, it took Romans much more years from battles in Greece to conquest of France etc. than we had and HIM died too young plus, again no sarcasm, what i like is that we battled as famous and ancient tribe as Greeks, eternal flavour to it, not some "bow and arrow" tribes outside of Europe ....but for science and origin (indeed it is most Latin sounding name in Europe maybe, Servi or Serbi) those are some interesting details told by Greeks themselves, hopefully appreciated by lovers ...for correctness (and sometimes is worth being selfsure) it seems that city in question IS from Macedonia (Greek one) after all ....should be Veria or Beria or our named Ber in Macedon and hence close to initial guessed region. Although there might be some confusion, but it is based on fact that initial Kantakouzenos c-attack came from Thessaloniki, his base, after he got in conflict with Dushan who besieged it almost whole life , and before he entered Constant etc. Though for truthness must be said that they also contested and changed hands of some cities and forts more towards Thrace, like Serres etc. A bit comical (wiki is to blame) but could be said that city from story is in Greek Macedon (btw, also seen on Orthelius map of Greece, just north of Pella, Philip's capital and Alexanders etc, glorious place for battles so i like) (not saying Abraham himself)) but there are few versions... sadly couldn't find perfect resolution of famous Europe map to read directly letter-by-letter names of few towns in our country he decided to put on greater map so i'm not sure until i find it, but there is some city in central Serbia he named Txxx-bury so English sounding But forever his pearl and shock to put (that is clearly visible) Taurunum (what is today suburb and Celtic-Roman named as well) in place of Belgrade or similar version in second half of XVI c, is so cool and unusual, almost humoristic. No idea how he heard of it, even in Italy, was just village ; ...but in mentioned maps of Greece some portions of country are also visible so he showed further detailed knowledge of some our forts and similar, but also along some more mythical and Italian sounding names..... not to mention many comical parts on continental map, lack of metnion of Croatia, Slavonia as Dalmatia, Russia small region in eastern Germania almost, small Poland, small France around Paris and big Gallia and so on, great fun of map like many old ones but on our things respectful thumbs up from me although he failed to put Ras (already less significant fort) on map, but placed Rascia across Danube, heard of Paracin, Topliza, Grachaniza, Priepolis and of course, great laugh, capital Taurunum .....obligation to look at if liking old maps although i talked some points before IIRC.
They heard of Pristina town but cutely named it Pistrina, sounds better and so on in that Italian sounding names, like it.... also how "fat" in their eyes south Servia looked like so from some towns close to today Montenegro border to east Serbia (Pirot) there is geographical distance almost covering hundreds of miles east of Greek "three fingered peninsula", far from real geography but cute.... how our once controlled Macedon is also huge in their mind and some cities in today North Macedon so much southern and spread almost half of Greece, much southern than Thessaloniki and similar, so cute... simply combined German, Spanish (as he worked for Spain) and Italian "knowledge" about us could not miss and maked us fat, generally those are all some medieval "allies" ; but don't think that was crucial maybe just some idea that some areas Serbs contested are much more spread etc. Like all must say again that without Italian lands we would struggle, maybe even crumble far behind in the middle ages, it is country that preseved and even strengthened our identity or similar, no question. XIX century is XIX c, some other country claims self importance for us, but without Italian co-op there would be nothing to "guard" or restore in XIX maybe... problem with Italy is that it is itself in some chaos and various troubles, but trashy like we all but is there greater praise for us than being once liked by country that created "Erupean civilization" (through orgy and mysery must say) but lovely ...... no we did not change our direction nor abandon you Italy, we were truthful to it as much as possible, even letting your origin guy kill that Austrian etc.... but wanted this to be nice post. always join if can add something or refresh something i said, really raised many subjects... - and saying just because i'm very interested in subject i find cinematic think that Eng-wiki page on Palman was slightly edited in recent times, only for small thing.... namely, i think, maybe wrong as explained that some time ago on Elizabeth Habsburg topic there was also line how she considered (besides things that stayed) also Serbia "barbarous country from the east" (meaning orthodox nothing else as that was some ususal divide) but now there is nosuch line, if i haven't imagined that Not so important and i said before that whole story "stinks" and looks more like ahe was killed by some agents than some "natural death" considering "high stakes" game Dushan played from start touching not only Hungary, but also almost all Euro powers of time as he clearly was on some "Colonna, ghibelline, Habsburg" side in given moment etc. But maintaining relatively open channel with France, directly asking French popes and clergy for some "capitain title" etc. Interesting subject and why some change if not my imagination.... as is, i think, maybe continentally interesting for struggles that happened and in both cases Colonnas were not outside of it ....but as is, remains enigma more and we will continue to lack docs surely.... but is interesting and must be historically fair from us all - to try to even approach it honestly and did Dushan's deals fail "due to Louis" or "due to French hopping to make some deals with Byzant, while Dushan was against" relatively "important" ; ....as for other part as is, we have in short but strong CV death of two Habsurgs - Elisabeth and Franz but take it seriously if you like subjects, maybe in England but do not know all details, tried to make it more interesting and where is trick, hope you get those small differences and nice moment from our era history (while our king wasn't at all, more from some Montenegro family origin related)) while quasi for Germans this propaganda film states presence of some docs and orders by Goering himslef, then freshly 2nd man in Germany, as page states... (both as parliament head and head of some intelligence and armed formations etc). Regarding Hermann, he was Germ politician that visited our state in interwar period the most, and as said was "behind coffin" of our king in Belgrade and even in Nirnberg trials mentioned his ties and Yugoslavia etc. Before taking his poison pill he also said as last words "they lie about me and Serb king, can't take it anymore" and died .....so generally interesting from that prism, even if speculative, or maybe not.... only thing that is historical fact, when it comes to "royal heads" is that murder of Austrian archduke was done by Italian origin man, on orders by French intelligence (seriously even some Belgian man is mentioned in relation to "black hand") and all blamed on Serbian king a bit of historical irony, isn't it ; .....but as then and 600 years past, France was also present in big way - could be said that both our peak kings (Miluten and Dushan) were the ones who maybe supported move of papacy to France (Miluten more certainly) and asked for military support from Papal states etc. while despot Stefan maybe helped first Colonna pope being elected and supported German imperial faction through continent, as talked..... when you connect it and philosophically approach it, it is interesting, even all to Elisabeth near marriage to 1914, same last name etc. Question is, as i talked on Sigismund theme, where we "lost our ways" and super fun that in both formulas there are two constants - France and Germany ...so i find interesting to talk medieval stories and put some light on them, so hopefully true lovers and not propagandists and political manipulators learned or heard some interesting details about us, Italian states and Frnace and German lands.... ...on photo (for schmeck) Speidel and Rommel.... maybe i'm not right, but on modern themes i often say that (like in meds) it was our ties with French more than any Russia that was "crucial"... would like honestly to hear from you fems from Italy, Germany and France on few questions I asked, but again meds is what I like ;.... must say (for Americans for example) that in 21st century we are blessed with really good relations with both France and Germany, constant guests there and overflowed with theiur arms and investments, alredy becoming "tiger" and intermarriage leaders there...... so luckily no troubles. Regarding "Yugoslavia", something very different than our emepror Dushan imagined before (though he maybe had some plans to include Croats and Dalmatia) - i honestly say that it failed more because some/all disliked our rule and maybe tribe, than someone outside "hated or disliked us" etc.... but generally we tried "imperialistic, enlargement and inclusive ways" more than once thorugh history, from Greeks to Alps seroiusly, one thing one can't blame us for is "balkanisation" i.e. desire for many small states, we were represents of bigger ones ; if you are to be realistic but nobody cares about it - after all we and Bulgars (maybe greatest rivalry in 1500 years) did finish in about same states (in population), almost funny - and with negative trends of course ;
they hated ...but seriously and without details, we and French recognize this as problems from start and it wasn't some "love song" from start i.e. Peter's death, often initiatives had to be pulled from French side or our like "Helen society" etc. to note some ties that will not break etc. if you get it a bit "behind kuloars (as French say) or behind kurvoars" (as we say) but seriously... there was no "blank support" for our king nor his instant "loyalty" to France, worked bothways and again, not because of stricktly political enviroment, but also social structure which wasn't "old Serbs" as before etc etc... so i say his visit is similar to French visits to Dushan, with some suspicion, though Lousi was guest before etc.... ironically like then, Italian lands were again factor and both our desire to maybe get closer with Italians, like 600 years before ; while Germany as well - as explained... black humor but funny.... Brits, masters of some "detection" (but often wrong) were right to speculate further, haven't mentioned before but also factor that new king is close with English royals, parading of Brits, their agents etc etc. wasn't so unimportant factor... so generally more complicated matter and I'm almost right to compare it with visits and talks with French officials our rulers had in meds ; and calling of king to Paris was similar..... to finish for lovers, it is indeed maybe noticeable that two main rivals in our modern history were maybe (loosely said) "French closer" Karageorgevichs (anglicanizedly writen)) and even George Petrovich called Nabulione into successful help - and Obrenovichs which indeed often showed some "German leanings" from Milosh who early invited German experts on some question till Milan who had very good ties in all German states, not only Austria..... all loosely and not so importantly said, mere observation and of course even Milan and Mihailo had "French connections" and education etc... so generally French, disliking that new orgy, killed both our king and old Barthou with one shot conclusions... i like to joke with French, they can take our joke, but wanted to seriously give some details if you never heard story.... IDK, personal opinion, though convinent as French were also targeted, that Hermann and Adolf were not behind this 
though they certainly did not care much... in monetary sense we even have one German dude (minister in small Serbia) above Tesla, Vuk etc. I think Bulgaria - declaring war as we speak in light of new evidence! ...again, take seriously some explain of relations. so in that light medieval stories are valuable as i bet that 95% of you did not know... and you get idea why persons from Helen, Miluten and Dushan were targeted and many sources intentionally hidden or ruined... but some survived, so Miluten called freaking Clement and Sciarra Colonnna into help!! etc if you get it, but OK maybe indeed in US they learn only history of "Anglo-Sexon" world, if at all but is cute when i hear it, doubt it is right, not to go back to old "tests" American pupils did about European countries when 30-40-50% actually placed Serbia on map (wherever)).......... anyway distracted myself, but just shortly and some medieval events starting with Byzantine claims that we instantly connected with Lombards and Normans upon arrival etc. (all talked later how it happened) there is that small theory that "Serbs" indeed were maybe some "stray" Germanic tribe hence similarities with Suebi, Suedi etc etc. again not important at all (unlike meds events i insist on as they are recorded history) but why not mentioning clearly as science theory.... problem with Germs is that they really "blew up" big time in XX c and nobody wanted to be related but what to do ;.... of all fascinating theories from Persia to Rome i'm closest (if we are to speculate) to last one - Servia, Servius and linguistic, though German tribes (stray) could also accept and learn Latin much more before others.......and so on, no politics. and only minus for them in relation to us (OK modern themes, they are too weak to have own opinion, joking)) is that "English" captured our Bodin as hooligans in Byzantine service.... but unlike Bulgarian rebel leader (Voiteh? or similar) Bodin survived, reached Antioh and back, became king and married Jaquinta - AND the rest is legend, we created Rascia and shaped modern world..... maybe we went far from Marsielle but to note for end, i really have no idea why countries like France and Germany several times through history tied with us, but repeat not important..... in modern themes, to say and repeat, due to political, religious etc reasons (and opportunistic) simply "hijacked" some our history and symbols (really from Roman legions to horny helmets) from faraway ones, to our close neighbors (declaring they are Gog and Magog while their tribe name doesn't sound so)) etc. to Bulgars claiming "Macedon is their" and so on.....there is need just to be realistic, science debate and fun to be real..... to finish, what i like that Italians which claimed some "civilization creation" were connected with us (aha Benito claimed "Dandolo" tie hence envious of our true kings)) French that claim "how Charlie created continent" were realted to us and Germans, which claim they are ancient and something - wanted to kill us just joking, seriously we had more Claudias than you imagine and almost queens of all 3 "importants" mentioned...........reagrding Marsielle (so symbolic as it is anthem of France) despite humor and police reaction, sorry for few girls which came "just to see our king" in best, clean clothes but died that day ;....imagine if Dushan was about to visit Paris and Marseille with his presence, would be madness, so i don't buy story about Elisabeth hahaaa.... finish this, but you add. in the opening along English and Spaniards but in non scientific way and as introduction to real facts post.... so in that sense ...to say that "old Serbs lived on banks of Vistula" is a bit controversial in whole science - for many reasons talked.... in that sense respect for mention but clearly in further "text" even authors expressed doubt and enigma so nothing bad or wrong there, "by the book", but we all expressed doubt, starting with Byzantines themselves... if we, even in some far stretched way, accept some idea that Serbs might be some "fraction" of (then more famous) Croats (but like that German theory that in "indo-european" SR- often in some miracoulous way transformed in HR- in speech)) simply doesn't explain much of linguistical phenomenon of "ekavianism" in east (Bulgars,Serbs,Macedon population) in light of fact that all other tribes do not use it... hence, in all areas "their speech" prevailed but not in Serbia and why if you get - maybe since majority of older of pop was able to "greco-latinize" speech, that is question if you get it, maybe i'm not always able to explain it in best way... and then why it ddi not happen with Croats (or Montenegro speech for example, important for our state as seen that our royality is connected with Zeta/Dioclea etc) since Croats are "recorded" clearly in Byzant service etc etc. Those are some small doubts and enigmas, which surely do not keep world awake at nights but are interesting.... most obvious answer (and root of Bulgar and Serb behavior) is presence of those legions in small area, famous and important in Roman history, rise of Caesar etc, plus some imperial cities and retreats - but then we come to tribe name which doesn't follow any "Slavic pattern" and new enigma is born.... which we all can translate as some "border men" loosely, Russ is something familiar for all i.e. due to specific mixing with some Viking branches etc, names like Slovenian or Slovak very much self-explained (so some "slavs") etc. Macedonian slavs used geography of not their origin, Montenegro self-explained (but for us also newer in origin) BUT and finally point after long and tedious intro to it - Serbs and Croats do not have such pattern indicating some really foreign origin, in short and talked... so for us must be the most accepted "Greek idea" of some "watch over or protection" (and maybe our presence long time ago, but i do not accept Serbs as sure) which maybe even gave name to "Ukraine", ironically maybe more because of old presence of some "guards" than their endonym, which bacame such...... must say, while no trouble to talk scientifically all "Slavic subjects", as seen to me a bit forced theme and maybe not even our that much.... like the noses (which are more some Scandianvian maybe than i said "Russian" as Estonian origin Matilda from video has it)) and so on, but really look at meds for us (and Croats) it was all about Hungaians, Greeks, Italians and we even nicely did with French and Germans etc..... nor is any idea of "origin" about "who is older" nor hardly Serbs or Croats making 10 mils at most could dominate anyone - but we have clear enigmas, Serbs maybe the most and words that even Bulgars (or Macedon pop) do not use, but freeky Romans did etc etc. You get idea why we find it interesting.... simply, there was no Slavic tribe with German imperial guard back then nor Baldovins and Altomanuses in high hierarchy except us..... but i meant something else as explained... beleive me topic is deep and great on many levels, but not crucial - even (while Italians used it before in papal scripts, not so dominant while Byzantines as said often said "Serbi and Tribali" meaning what exactly? maybe to distinct Serbs from some "slaves") "Sclavinie" was not used in Italian (central and northern) redactions and comments of Dante's work (it is huge and i posted parts once) when they talked about Miluten and Rascia - it started to be used more since XVI-XVII c, when we fell long time ago etc etc. Those are details changing no substance, but for delicate detective eyes (in that sense US video is right as it gave no answer) instantly raised suspicion... almost like DAI which "bite own tongue" with Servia line - albeit and again Greeks did not hide some distinctions and connected with us more easily, so even Bodin's fate is some indication of some of it, Dushan's and Kantakouzenos' talks where our king often is "threating" Greeks "to remember" (who is older)).... simply said, super fun subjects a bit of blessing for us, but apolitical.... simply so many controversies and hidden sources and facts on us and almost every med ruler "handicaped" so we do not complete papirology for even any peek king.... what is fun, again - that some "newcomers" (i mean in Byzant regions, in that sense even Vinegia and French after "Latin empire") instantly connected with us, not Bulgars, not those or that, as talked.... just leave politics and (quasi) rigid sectal divide out of it and it is pure sceintifical enigma.... don't let my remind me about some other enigmas and choices you could be faced with if our glorious queen Jaquinta asks you super story, like, deserves film, we have many and even mentioned scene with Dushan and "Kanta" (as ancient proud Greek) going face to face (or Louis) is out of "hollywood film" so no idea why our filmmakers never used so cinematic stories, as said million times..... as for many words, hopefully understood, as said i love (have some texts prepared so not typing everytime) so why not sharingand really hope you like it if never heard but generally i abandoned that "Persianism" origin theory (as we all in Europe are from India anyway)) in favor of more modern Celtic and Roman mix, as said many times. of all tribes that ever were in continent it was the Gaulish (small distinction from Celts but same) Serdii that share the name closest to Serbs, so why not thinking about it as serious possibility, and on on top of all they lived in regions Serbs later contested etc etc. no repeat, but for lovers to absolve.... never against HIM ...but seriously, think idea was good even Petrarca gave thumbs up and Vinegia with citizenship, reserved only for deserved ones ....but instead of "philosophy" think stories deserve more film as you can't find much nobles with lions, horns and aquilas on helmets and such cinematic "eyecandies", foreign troops etc. like here. Maybe whole events were a bit in shadow of "hundred years war" (quasi more important as it is in W Europe) but don't see any reason Americans would not watch such epic dramma film if skillfully directed (but i'm fearing that AI and computers are killing nice films needing millions of dollars otherwise)) there are even easy names they can remember - Altomanus, HIM, Baldovin, Palman, Branko and Greeks and Hungarians of French origin .....coming in 2128 that much, hope you catched some nice historical facts between my observations and cinematic eye for good stories..... for example Palman's story has even that "PC" born with the handicapbut became great - and what to say about Jaquinta, all about female rights...)) unlike Brits, we failed to recognize "class" through history and name some tank "Jaquinta" Mk 1,2 etc, but we could as they did........... there is chance still ) but tanks are "de-mode" so spaceship.... for Uranus, not so much for touching and invading Mars as some - because you see and as explained, my family name and origin might be from Mars.... Nemanio monumet was nice move, but even in some "reljef" works below his fits of whole dynasty there are no foreign girls that made dynasty great indeed ....hopefully they are to follow as well as some others on horses of course as said, spaceships are priority... and then tanks, then big rockets - just not to go to Uranus empty handed and undefended.... ....lovely but not important, we simply ruled and you of course like 
...and standing 100% behind 272 m to Anna though now more in Jaquinta's camp..... But the one point i like the most is - quasi concern why is the man (25 meters tall, btw) holding the sword and not (imagine, thatis their concern) some "Russian cross" as was also idea? So i ask why would man whose son was a catholic and other son married catholic princess that was closely related to fall of Constant hold "Russian cross" at all and so on, would prefer horse as well.... Russian sculptor changed it himself (maybe on advice) but from his side once to say as not some Rossofil (modern name) very right and honorable move and he said well that it represent Nemanio as "Serb statesman and in civil service" and not some "orthodox nor pan-anything priest" so thums up ......now there is other question raised - is sword actually to represent thatwe are gonna slaughter them all etc..... we Serbs are funny and a bit "trashy like all" while i'm not defending apriori any solution but like size and leave it to really people from art branche to judge is it ugly, not well in exterior, wrongly made etc etc. and here even admit (with shame as it is my passion) that did not even follow debates nor even 2% of arguments..... but again and 100x and signed with own blood for (even) Felix, any foreign queen i.e. Jaquinta, Elen and Anna my blessing and uncoditional support and even to be our trademarks.... glory to Nemanides ....went just a bit around some European places (you maybe more) but noticed history much, much more visible and monumental, so while i do not even know arguments - sad that Nemanio and figures we had are even discussed in sometimes primitive and (what word) sad way and actually it belongs here more than some monstrousity beside beutiful Studenica or maybe in Ras, or Novi Pazar with majority of islamic population etc. ....if it's just because of rossian sculptor i promise that for Jaquinta it is gonna be French girl sculptor but we will politely avoid any symbolism of "eggs" (i.e. balls) on her soon to come beuatiful monument, if you support.... humor aside would be cool, for all 3 and don't mind me always be "devilish" but honestly like meds and would die for Nemanides and our queens even more (hope for US watched films once as it truly is cinematic and even above-national as was our history of times)
